What Does a Fourth Cousin Relationship Look Like?

 

Uncle Peg’s Chronicles

October 29, 2026

What Does a Fourth Cousin Relationship Look Like?

 

“These were their settlements. And they kept good family records.”

 

Don’t forget to look for the title which is embedded in the chronicle.

 

 

 

FAMILY ALBUM

 

The year - 2008. The location – Caledonia Mountain, Albert County, New Brunswick. The person – Brett Nolte. What is he standing beside?

 

And I Quote:

 

I loved, loved, loved this issue, especially the pics of your dad and U. Ralph and the Pierce-Auto.

 

The guest book entries and info was most interesting, making me wish that I had kept a guest book.

 

I like to hear all the old names, not that I'm a big fan particularly of names like Herbert and Ira.  I do think that they would be popular names in their day. ~ Ruth

 

This is not in relation to the chronicle, but an answer to my question to Susan and Kirk: “Are you home yet?”

Hi Peg, we made it home safely! It was such a wonderful trip and we saw so much. When we left Moncton we went to Nova Scotia and spent two weeks there. I saw on Facebook that you were there too! We stumbled upon the Scarecrow Festival at Mahone Bay too. It was so cute! and one of our highlights. Of course, we loved Cabot Trail and Halifax. We camped along the way and met so many awesome people. We ate so much lobster (from lobster sushi to lobster poutine lol). After NS we took the ferry to PEI. We just spent a few days there, covering Cavendish Red beach and ice cream at Holman's in Summerside. Then we followed fall leaf peeping and went to Quebec and saw Montmorency Falls plus we ate pastrami sandwiches at Schwartz's Deli in Montreal. Phew, how did we do? Did we see much of Canada? Anyway, we loved it. Thank you so much for taking me to the genealogy meeting. It was fascinating. Let me know if you pursue the Loyalist Group. I'm interested too or maybe you can put it in the newsletter, if you do. 

Again, it was a pleasure to see you, take care, Susan and Kirk

 

1926 to 1928

 

1924 to 1928 are the years that our Holmes ancestors spent renewing relationships that had somehow fallen by the wayside but with organization, letter writing, and challenging travel – by hook or by crook – they managed to come together again. They reacquainted and rediscovered their family ties. And then, one by one, they died, and many of those ties died with them.

2026 to 2028

 

As I chatted over dinner with Kirk and Susan (Hyde) Jackson (of the Louisa Holmes Ballantyne line), in September, she asked me a question that caught me off guard: “are there any musicians in our Holmes family? There are none in mine.”

 

Oh my, where to begin? If there are no musicians in your line, Susan, be assured, your ancestors, direct and collateral, were certainly gifted. They are next in line for me to update, and already I have found a new addition to their story. They were teachers, lawyers, office workers . . . and I’ll have to revisit them to find out just everything there is to know about them. It will be a while, as I have to prepare for my presentation, but I hope to find more.

 

There are musicians in our family – past and present. I trust there always will be. Sometime, I should make a list. Susan, you asked an excellent question.

 

Brian Holmes (William N Holmes line, son of Fen) recently wrote music for a carol, revising from soprano to  four parts (SATB) at my request. He sets old poems to music for Christmas greetings. Last year’s poem was “Carol We High, Carol We Low,” which was published in a 1916 compilation of carols by Charles Lewis Hutchins, called “Carols Old and Carols New.”

On Wednesday the 21st, I went to the church and printed (with his permission) forty-five copies. They are now in our folders. On Saturday the 24^th, our choir members went to our annual Christmas retreat to sight-read all of our upcoming Christmas music. In December, my choir will sing an anonymous old carol set to Brian’s music. Yes, I am excited.

1. Carol we high, carol we low,
Sweetly carol we soft and slow;
Carol we loud with the angel throng,
Carol we joyfully all night long.

2. Carol of fields, where in the night
Wakeful shepherds beheld a light;
Heard with amaze how in Bethlehem
Jesus, the Saviour, was born for them.

3. Carol how they joyfully ran,
There to behold their God made Man;
Leaving their flocks in the fields to be
Kept by the angels, right fearlessly.

4. Carol of how all on the hay
He whom the angels told of, lay;
Tenderly cherished by Mary's love,
Rev'rently worshipped by hosts above.

A wee bit of Brian’s story: https://missionchamber.org/brian-holmes/

 

DNA NEWS

Every so often, I check my DNA conundrums to see if there is an update. I regularly check the origin of Janet Minella Nolte’s grandfather. This week, I checked on Janet’s DNA, and I added a couple of new family lines to her probable Ellis ancestors. The amount of DNA that Janet shares with a lady named Gwendolyn is 2% shared DNA: 107 cM across four segments – the longest being 35 cM. I haven’t seen Gwendolyn’s name before, and she only has five people in her tree. I believe they are a fourth cousin match. (Please correct me if you think I am wrong.)

I don’t consider myself overly knowledgeable about DNA, but I know some of the basics. I wanted to know where Janet fit in her list of matches. Her strongest maternal match is with Scott Underhill, of the Charles R Holmes line. She is between Marika Patterson and Marie Dockter. I know for a fact that these Scott and these two ladies are in the Holmes line; Marika is in the Charles R Holmes line, and Marie, in the William N Holmes line. There is no disputing the fact that Janet has Holmes DNA. Comparing these individuals:

Holmes line - Scott: 6% shared DNA: 421 cM across 19 segments

Holmes line - Marika: 2% shared DNA: 112 cM across 7 segments

Ellis line - Gwendolyn: 2% shared DNA: 107 cM across 4 segments

Holmes line - Marie: 2% shared DNA: 105 cM across 7 segments

 

By doing some traditional research, I determined that Janet and Gwendolyn are fourth cousins. They share great-great-great grandparents, William N Ellis (by traditional research) and Nancy aka Ann Campbell (by traditional and DNA research).

 

I explored two other matches and added them to her tree, but this is the closest Ellis match I have found. The list of her Ellis DNA connections is growing.

 

I revisited the William Ellis who I believe is the father of Lillian Holmes Underhill, but I found nothing new. Is William even correct? I still wonder. I wish I knew why young William disappeared. All I can say is that Janet’s grandfather is likely Mister Ellis, but I believe that Janet’s paternal great-grandparents are William T Ellis, born 1847 in East Bideford, Prince Edward Island, and Amanda A Blakney, born 1854 in New Brunswick. I don’t find much DNA evidence for the Blakney side, but I do find traditional evidence.

 

Here is a FamilySearch link to explain centimorgans, if it interests you: https://www.familysearch.org/en/blog/centimorgan-chart-understanding-dna

 

What does a fourth cousin relationship look like? I have chosen four individuals from our Holmes family tree, solely for comparison purposes, so you can see a third great grandparent/fourth cousin relationship.

Charles (Stoney) Worster – Bertha Holmes Worster – Charles H Holmes – William N Holmes – Daniel Holmes – Samuel Holmes Jr.

Eleanor Holmes Wilson – Julian Holmes – Cecil T Holmes – Peter K Holmes – Daniel Holmes – Samuel Holmes Jr.

Peg Moore Vasseur – Margaret Holmes Moore – Floyd Holmes – Charles R Holmes – Daniel Holmes – Samuel Holmes Jr.

Janet Minella Note – Lillian Holmes Underhill Minella – Ella Holmes Underhill – Charles R Holmes – Daniel Holmes – Samuel Holmes Jr. 

Comparing Janet and her DNA match, Gwendolyn, at 107 cM over four segments, with the longest segment being 35 cM:

Janet Minella Nolte – Lillian Holmes Underhill Minella – Mister Ellis (possibly William) – William T Ellis – James Ellis – Nancy AKA Ann Campbell Ellis.

Gwendlyn née Johnstone – Harriet Mountain Johnstone – M Janetta Horne Mountain – Sarah Jane MacLean Horne – Sarah Ellis MacLean – Nancy AKA Ann Campbell Ellis.

William N Ellis and Nancy aka Ann Campbell married and had several children, including James and Sarah. James Ellis and Sarah Ellis MacLean are siblings. William T Ellis and Sarah Jane MacLean Horne are first cousins. Mister Ellis and Janetta Horne Mountain are second cousins. Lillian Holmes Underhill Minella and Harriet Mountain Johnstone are third cousins.  Janet and Gwendolyn are fourth cousins.

General rule - take all AI answers with a grain of salt. In this case, it gives sources in brackets, which is good. I guessed at Gwen’s age, based on the marriage of her parents; Janet was born in 1933. I asked AI: “Is 2% shared DNA of 107 cM across 4 segments with the longest segment being 35 cM, with one born 1940 and one born 1933 and a common surname Ellis and at Ancestry a good match,” and got this response:

 

AI Overview

Yes, this is an excellent, highly actionable DNA match. At AncestryDNA, sharing 107 cM across 4 segments with a longest segment of 35 cM represents a solid biological relationship. Because the two individuals were born so close in time (1933 and 1940), they belong to the exact same generation, which significantly simplifies narrowing down the family tree. 

Explore Your DNA +1

The combination of the genetic data, the generational alignment, and the shared surname Ellis gives you a massive head start in confirming exactly how you are related.

---

🧬 Why the Genetic Data is Strong

• The Longest Segment (35 cM): This is the most crucial detail. A longest segment of 35 cM is large enough to safely rule out "sticky segments" (distant, random population matching). It proves a recent, definitive common ancestor. 

MyHeritage Knowledge Base +3

• The Segment Count (4 segments): Sharing 107 cM across just 4 segments means the pieces of DNA are large and intact, which is highly characteristic of closer, more recent cousin relationships rather than distant multi-generational ones. 

Living DNA

📅 Generational Alignment (1933 vs. 1940)

Because both individuals were born within 7 years of each other, you do not have to worry about "once removed" or "twice removed" generational gaps. You are looking for a same-generation cousin relationship. 

Based on statistical data from the Shared cM Project on DNA Painter, here are the most likely relationships for 107 cM where the individuals are in the same generation: 

DNA Painter

Relationship	Probability	What it Means
Second Cousin (2C)	Highest Probability (~35-40%)	You share the same Great-Grandparents (an Ellis couple).
Half Second Cousin	Moderate Probability	You share only one Great-Grandparent (an Ellis individual who remarried).
Third Cousin (3C)	Lower Probability	You share the same 2nd Great-Grandparents. (Note: 107 cM is a bit high for a standard 3C, making 2C more likely).

🔍 How to Use the "Ellis" Surname to Solve This

Finding a shared surname on a match of this strength is the ultimate clue. Since you both share the Ellis name, follow these targeted steps on Ancestry to find the exact connection: 

Explore Your DNA

1. Check the Match's Tree for Ellis: Look at their public or unlinked tree. Specifically look for an Ellis ancestor born roughly between 1860 and 1890—this would be the right timeframe for a Great-Grandparent to children born in the 1930s/1940s.
2. Examine "Shared Matches": Click on the match and view your Shared Matches. If you see other known cousins from your Ellis branch, it confirms this match belongs exclusively to that lineage.
3. Trace the Descendants: Look at your own Ellis great-grandparents. List all of their children (your grandparents' siblings). One of those grand-uncles or grand-aunts is highly likely to be the direct ancestor of your 1933/1940 match.

 

FAMILY HISTORY LESSON

Robert Ballantyne’s Probat

Robert R Ballantyne, husband of Louisa Holmes, died suddenly and intestate. He was fifty years of age. When this happens, and the decedent has a sizeable estate, the court must appoint an administrator of the estate for the probate. They appointed his eldest son, Daniel W Ballantyne.

Daniel Ballantyne – Robert R and Sarah Louise (Holmes) Ballantyne – Daniel and Charlotte (Hoyt) Holmes.

Note that Grace’s name is written several times as “Grace E. H. Ballantyne.” I don’t recall ever seeing an “E” as a middle name. Alice is written “Allie,” and Winafred as “Wina.”

 To the Honorable James H. Burgess, Judge of Probate for the County of Penobscot

         We the subscribers represent that Robert R Ballantyne a resident of Lincoln in said County at the time of his decease, died on the 27^th day of January A.D. 1892, intestate, possessed of estate exceeding the Sum of one hundred dollars, which ought to be Administered according to law, and prays that administration thereof be granted to Daniel W. Ballantyne, a Son of said deceased, Said Daniel W. Ballantyne is twenty one years of age and suitably qualified for Said trust                                                                                                                                                                         We also state that our relationship to Said deceased is as is written to A right of our respective names, and that we are the only relatives who are of Age, and that there are five minor children of said deceased, living

                                                                                                Sarah L. Ballantyne widow                                                                                                                                                            Grace E. H. Ballantyne daughter                                                                                                                                                 Wina L. Ballantyne daughter

Lincoln, Me. Feb 5 – 92

Citation: FamilySearch Full Text. Penobscot. Probate Records 1816-1915, Probate Estate Case Files 1816-1915. Images 358 – 377. Accessed October 22, 2026. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-896B-YDRS?view=fullText&keywords=Daniel+W.+Ballantyne%2CMAINE&searchForm=advanced&lang=en

Uncle Peg wishes you a happy, ancestor haunted Hallowe’en.

This ends week forty - three of our centennial virtual celebration of 1926 – 2026.

 

 

No Place to Dream On

 

 Uncle Peg’s Chronicles

October 15, 2026

“No Place to Dream On”

 

“These were their settlements. And they kept good family records.”^[1]

 

Don’t forget to look for the title which is embedded in the chronicle.

 

 

 

FAMILY ALBUM

 

And I Quote:

 

I enjoyed reading your "My Story." Byron and I often enjoy walking through the woods behind our home but also like to find new places to hike and this time of year is the best. I love seeing the leaves changing color and raining down upon us as we traverse the trails and enjoy the fall aromas and sounds of nature the wooded forests offer us. Glad to see you had some nice visits with cousins too. ~ Annmarie Driscoll Holmes.

 

Peg, Loved the story of the violin. ~ Karl

 

Peg, Loved the pics as always but was really fascinated by the story of Billy and the violin.  Don't you wish we could go back and spend a day with them?  Billy sounds like he might have become an engineer if born at a later time.  Keep up the good work, interesting stuff. ~ Ruth – a conversation ensued.

 

Thank you for your Oct 2 chronicle Peggy. Lovely story telling as always and good facts and photo shares. ~ Jolynda

 

I am so glad about getting the chronicles that you spend much time writing.  Thanks for including me! ~

Janet.

 

It was nice to see you again. Thanks for including me in the chronicle. I really enjoyed reading it. ~ Tim

 

The time and effort in the research you did is amazing, as always.  I hope everyone appreciates the contribution you are making. ~ from Paula, re my article, not my chronicle.

 

Thanks, everybody.

 

I didn’t have a photo in mind for the header, so I scrolled down my massive collection of photos, looking for something fun and different. My father, Donald Moore, is on the left, and my uncle, Ralph Lutes, is on the right. They are in front of the farm house in Hill Grove, taking down the willow tree. They look like they are having fun, but perhaps they just stopped their sawing to grin for the camera. No idea when they did this. However, the photo reminded me of the quote of Natalie Goldberg, which is in the section 2026 to 2028. That is the yard that was recently hayed, where in September, I sat upon a log from one of those felled trees, to eat my cake. The tire swing is long gone, but I remember it. Once upon a time, not so very long ago, it was a beautiful lawn.

 

 

1926 to 1928

 

1924 to 1928 are the years that our Holmes ancestors spent renewing relationships that had somehow fallen by the wayside but with organization, letter writing, and challenging travel – by hook or by crook – they managed to come together again. They reacquainted and rediscovered their family ties. And then, one by one, they died, and many of those ties died with them.

2026 to 2028

 

What a relief it is to send off an article to “Generations.” It’s a release. It is done. Whether or not it is entirely correct or finished is irrelevant. Too late now. I need to finish up the family version, which will have some changes and more information for family purposes and not be under the copyright of the journal.

 

That will sit on my shoulders for a while. I also have two articles on the back burner of my brain, about two men who visited Riverbank House quite often and had stories that intrigued me, although the gentlemen are not in the family. The articles won’t be as long, but I’m sure I’ll be just as compulsive about my words and paragraphs as I am with our family history. No rush on those. For now, I have something else to concentrate on.

 

I agreed to give a presentation to the Saint John branch of the genealogy society at the end of January. This will be via Zoom, so I won’t have to travel in winter. You can join me if you like. The topic they asked for is “tips for writing a family history story.” Title, for now, is the same, although I might squeeze a sub-title in there – who knows. I want to leave the word “tips” in there to keep me in blinders – as I cannot teach how to write a full family history story in forty-five minutes. I am going to focus on William Zinsser’s book, “On Writing Well,” but I am also reading other how-to writing books. Zinsser’s is the only book I have found on non-fiction writing. The others concern writing in general.

 

So, what does that have to do with you and this chronicle?

 

This presentation will come from two basic sources: my how-to books and my experience. I write for two audiences – you, my cousins, and those members of NBGS who read my article in the journal. I practice my writing on you. Some of you edit and read for me. And some of you comment – see the quotes in the letters to the editor at the start. I give you excerpts – I don’t often include the personal stuff you share with me.

 

I thank you so very much.

 

Tip: You have to write for your audience, but write for yourself as well. Write naturally. Your voice will eventually find you, as you go along.

 

It’s like inheriting land from your family. It’s always been in your family: they have always owned it. Someone comes along and wants to buy it. Writers, if they are smart, won’t sell too much of it. They know once it’s sold, they might be able to buy a second car, but there will be no place they can go to sit still, no place to dream on. Natalie Goldbert, “Writing Down the Bones,” page34. That chapter was about many writers’ dream to sell their work and making lots of money. Unless you depend on royalties for a living, it’s a pipedream. 

 

The quote was a trigger for me – back to September, when I went to the Cedar Café and bought an expensive piece of cake and sat on an old log on family property and ate it before walking the newly hayed imaginary dooryard, front lawn, and orchard.

 

Tip: Make use of your verbs.

 

Verbs are the most important of all your tools. They push the sentence forward and give it momentum. Active verbs push hard; passive verbs tug fitfully. Active verbs also enable us to visualize an activity . . . Many verbs also carry in their imagery or in their sound a suggestion of what they mean: glitter, dazzle, twirl, beguile, scatter, swagger, poke, pamper, vex . . . Don’t choose one that is dull or merely serviceable . . . Be precise, use precise verbs.

 

Then William Zinsser goes on to talk about adverbs and adjectives and nouns, in his book on how to write non-fiction, “On Writing Well,” page 68.  

 

As I research, I learn. Hopefully, my next articles will be better.

 

 

 

News from Holmes

Congratulations to Wesley and Bailey (Hamblin) Hagmann on the arrival of their third son, Ranger Cage. Ranger arrived in a hurry on September 30^th. He is also welcomed by his brothers, Wylder and Dash, his grandmother, Michelle (Holmes) Morey, his grandfather, Jon Hamblin. Sorely missed: Rick Morey and Butch Holmes would be so proud.

Ranger – Wesley Hagmann and Bailey Hamblin – Jon Hamblin and Michelle Holmes (and Rick Morey) – Fenwick ‘Butch’ Holmes and Karla Lay (and Connie Lepon) – Jerome K Holmes and Alma Vincent – Jerome C Holmes and Jennie Edwards – William Holmes and Anna Heath – Daniel Holmes and Charlotte Hoyt – Samuel Holmes Jr and Phoebe Holstead – Samuel Holmes Sr and Elizabeth Fountain.

Ask for a photo and I'll send you an email.

FAMILY HISTORY LESSON

Busy, so here is another section from my article for Generations. I think most of you know that I have Uncle Billy’s guest book. In the article and CCC, there will be footnotes.

THE GUEST BOOK

1909 – 1915

On the second day of September 1912 there came to this pleasant valley two young fellows from Montclair New Jersey USA by the names of Herbert Snead and Ira S Snead, who stayed a week, caught a few fish . . . and had the time of their lives.

Between Billy and Maggie Snider’s return from Sussex and 1909, they changed the name of their lodge from Portage House to Riverbank House. I used both newspaper accounts and the guest book to research the lodge and some of the guests. Thanks to my research, I changed my opinion about Uncle Billy from thinking he was a mere tinker to getting to know a multi-faceted, interesting individual. They were a generous couple. I enjoyed reading and sharing quotes from their guest book – they are an apt description of the ambiance of both Portage Vale and the lodge.  

Spent a few days around Portage with H. K.

The guest book remained in the desk in the farmhouse kitchen for years. When my cousin handed it to me at a family reunion, Mum remembered seeing it. It is an important family and local historical list. I scanned it and put it into the New Brunswick Genealogy Society website so it will not be lost. The fact that the Riverbank House proprietors hosted people from near and far shows that the Sniders had an eclectic circle of family, friends, and acquaintances.

 

8 doz trout and a Bully Time.

                I studied several of the people who signed the Riverbank Visitors guest book. The guest house and fishing lodge opened much earlier than that, but this is the only guest book I have. Some people did not state where they came from. Some people signed the book once; some, several times. Some people’s writing was illegible. Some came for a day; some stayed days or weeks. There were 45 names of Snider and Holmes family members in the guest book.                                                                                                

Dunfield, Gifford, McAnespy and Teakles neighbours could walk there.                                                                

Members of the clergy visited. Rev’d Canon Smithers came from Fredericton in 1909. Rev. R Coleman of Petitcodiac came in 1910. Elder Elmer Roman and Elder Jas V Facer, from Utah, also visited in 1910.                                                                                                                                                                                                               

From the opposite side of the continent, a Mitchell family travelled from Victoria, British Columbia. Mrs. Herbert A Steeves came from Seattle, Washington.   

There were international visitors. Robert Matthew came from Cuba in 1911; Maurice Karn, from London, England, in 1911; and a Mr. Giles, from London, England, in 1912. Frances Smallwood came from St. John’s, Newfoundland, in 1911. Newfoundland was not part of Canada at that time.  

 They held political meetings there. On March 29, 1911, when the Liberal Conservative Club met, three men signed their names: Frank E Wallace, Kenneth R McLeod, and Walter Murray.                                                       

One child, Vivian Mitchell from Victoria, British Columbia, printed her name in the book. A toddler’s name was listed: James Hallett from Montreal.  There were two students from McGill University in Quebec: Roy A Davidson and a Routledge.

April 26 - April 28 – Caught 6 trout April 27^th weighing ¾ pound. 

Two of their guests particularly intrigued me. D Arnold Fox, who made a G-clef sign under his name and often talked about fish, was the organist of the Stone Church in Saint John. The other was Brigadier General Darias B Warner. Both men signed the first page of the book, several times in between, and Warner, the last page. Perhaps Gen. Warner and Prof. Fox were paying guests who became friends of the Sniders.

. . . Battle of Kennesaw Mountain 1864

Why did they come? Was it the need for lodging, a meeting, a little getaway from a busy life, curiosity, a neighbourly cup of tea? It was probably all that and more.            

Plenty of fish and pancakes.

How awesome it must have been for Billy and Maggie to watch auto parties drive up to the guest lodge.                                                                                                                                                                                                 

In 1913, a group of Thomas Bell, R G Haley, W B Tennant, and Wm Woodhouse, the chauffeur, all of Saint John, arrived, calling themselves the Pierce-Arrow party. What a beauty the Pierce-Auto was to behold.

Fish feeding well.

The people who signed the guest book were diverse: family members, neighbours, friends, travellers, musicians, politicians, competitive bridge players, automobile partiers, etc. From the few comments, it appears that all enjoyed the hospitality of the Sniders as well as the locality.

Mid-October in New Brunswick – a mix of sun, cloud, and rain, depending on the day. You might need a winter jacket in the morning and shorts and a t-shirt in the afternoon, but we are edging ever closer to the sweaters and jackets. The leaves are falling.

This ends week forty -two of our centennial virtual celebration of 1926 – 2026.